tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-32542246.post5030629413433475913..comments2024-02-24T05:19:10.949-05:00Comments on Durham-in-Wonderland: Nifong and the Black Votekcjohnson9http://www.blogger.com/profile/09625813296986996867noreply@blogger.comBlogger46125tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-32542246.post-42966218123645902282007-09-10T03:07:00.000-04:002007-09-10T03:07:00.000-04:00Excellent website. Good work. Very useful. I will ...Excellent website. Good work. Very useful. I will bookmark!Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-32542246.post-75902583256775032212007-08-18T07:29:00.000-04:002007-08-18T07:29:00.000-04:00Great article! Thanks.Great article! Thanks.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-32542246.post-11981921233771318432006-11-15T13:38:00.000-05:002006-11-15T13:38:00.000-05:00All I can say with regard to Grant Farrad's writin...All I can say with regard to Grant Farrad's writing is: Huh?<br /><br />How do professors who write like that actually teach? Do they just end up spouting incomprehensible gobbledygook to a roomful of sleeping kids?<br /><br />JerriAnonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-32542246.post-48396087897259836112006-11-10T19:49:00.000-05:002006-11-10T19:49:00.000-05:00I'm writing this at 8pm on 11/10/06, nearly 24 hou...I'm writing this at 8pm on 11/10/06, nearly 24 hours after the previous comment.<br /><br />Here and at a number of other threads at Prof. Johnson's blog, folks sometimes write in to say things like, "if the three alleged rapists are as innocent as you claim, they can be proven innocent at trial."<br /><br />Examples here are at anonymous at 7:41am and anonymous at 10:22am.<br /><br />At 10:55am, I asked (politely, I hope) for a link to an article that makes a reasonable, supported case:<br /><br />(1) That a rape, kidnapping, or assault was committed the night of March 13th; <br /><br />and if so, <br /><br />(2) That evidence exists that implicates the three accused men in these crimes.<br /><br />I don't know of such an article. I assume KC Johnson doesn't either, as I suspect he would have linked to it a long time ago. By their silence, anonymous 7:41am and anonymous 10:22am seem to suggest that they, also can't put their finger on such an essay.<br /><br />The case could fairly be characterized as going to trial <i>in the absence of a single indication that suggests that a felony occured or that the accused men were perpetrators.</i><br /><br />Yet some people support D.A. Nifong as he continues exalting his perverse concept of Social Justice, in a parody of the practices and procedures of the Criminal Justice system.<br /><br />Amazing, and disheartening.AMachttps://www.blogger.com/profile/08872008617279528583noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-32542246.post-18621375474611421482006-11-09T23:31:00.000-05:002006-11-09T23:31:00.000-05:00No recording of the GJ hearing, only Gottlieb and ...No recording of the GJ hearing, only Gottlieb and Himan were witnesses. Exculpatory evidence not required. <br /><br />Easy to guess what was not presented... nothing about the 2 previous photo ID attempts, or the fact that the physical descriptions didn't match the accused, nothing about the lack of DNA, nothing about the lack of medical evidence, nothing about her changing stories, nothing about Kim's "crock" statement, nothing about Kim being involved in the attack... <br /><br />NC's GJ system screams for reform.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-32542246.post-56696093907878285492006-11-09T18:41:00.000-05:002006-11-09T18:41:00.000-05:00This comment has been removed by a blog administrator.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-32542246.post-22012358666712768512006-11-09T17:40:00.000-05:002006-11-09T17:40:00.000-05:00I really am surprised that the poster made the com...I really am surprised that the poster made the comment that an indictment was "proof" that a rape was committed and, most likely, by Finnerty, Seligmann, and Evans.<br /><br />Most people do not understand the modern grand jury process. It no longer stands as a hurdle for prosecutors, as prosecutors generally control grand juries. In North Carolina, it is very, very rare that prosecutors are rebuffed by grand juries. I doubt that Liefong brought in any "experts" other than "police officers," and we already know the reliability of his main investigator at the time, Gottlieb.<br /><br />So, I suppose the poster says that we should not even have trials, just move directly from indictment to sentencing. Think how many black men have been railroaded by this very process, and for someone to endorse it for racial reasons really smacks either of outright ignorance of how the justice system (sic) really works, or of a desire to do away with any decency and fairness that might be left in this God-forsaken system.<br /><br />William L. AndersonAnonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-32542246.post-80635544059929822422006-11-09T16:58:00.000-05:002006-11-09T16:58:00.000-05:00Ed Bradley was a great man, a hero in many people'...Ed Bradley was a great man, a hero in many people's eyes. God Bless you Ed Bradley.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-32542246.post-21079059696761772832006-11-09T16:50:00.000-05:002006-11-09T16:50:00.000-05:00No matter what state you are in, write your letter...No matter what state you are in, write your letters to your senators, congressmen and assemblymen, write to the Department of Justice, let your voices be heard by your government that is supposed to protect the Constitutional rights of each citizen. This case goes beyond corruption of its lowest form, it goes beyond politics, the humanity of it has reached out to 80 countries throughout the world all looking at U.S. and wondering why the Federal Government is not stopping this terrorist. Speak out against this injustice. Lets get answers to why the NC Bar is ignoring Nifongs prosecutorial misconduct, why sexual harrassmentis allowed in his office, apparantly Nifong is extorting favors from many people in Durham.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-32542246.post-39848775339364325092006-11-09T16:01:00.000-05:002006-11-09T16:01:00.000-05:00Thank you Ed Bradley, for all you did for Colin, D...Thank you Ed Bradley, for all you did for Colin, David, and Reade. I will miss you on 60 Minutes.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-32542246.post-58915388872690557352006-11-09T13:09:00.000-05:002006-11-09T13:09:00.000-05:00Sadly, it has just been reported that Ed Bradley d...Sadly, it has just been reported that Ed Bradley died today, at age 65. He had leukemia, but still chose to do the interviews with Reade, Collin, David and Kim. What a great guy!Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-32542246.post-25410600014715785782006-11-09T12:50:00.000-05:002006-11-09T12:50:00.000-05:00Dont these blacks know that Duke is the largest em...Dont these blacks know that Duke is the largest employer of them in Durham?Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-32542246.post-26984530742643333742006-11-09T11:54:00.000-05:002006-11-09T11:54:00.000-05:00if i understand your argument in this posting, it ...if i understand your argument in this posting, it seems you have made an error of ecological inference; that is to say, you moved from population-level data (the racial make-up of a precinct) to an assumption about individual behavior. The numbers you present should be examined with a proper statistical model before you can make the conclusions you have made. See G.King, 1997 "A Solution to the Ecological Inference Problem."<br /><br />http://gking.harvard.edu/eicamera/kinroot.htmlAnonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-32542246.post-838096234938656122006-11-09T11:03:00.000-05:002006-11-09T11:03:00.000-05:00To the 10.48:
Voter turnout in black precincts (w...To the 10.48:<br /><br />Voter turnout in black precincts (with the exception of the NCCU precinct) was slightly lower than in predominantly white precincts, but there wasn't a major difference.kcjohnson9https://www.blogger.com/profile/09625813296986996867noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-32542246.post-59962808483625640412006-11-09T11:00:00.000-05:002006-11-09T11:00:00.000-05:00"It is my opinion that the Black vote in Durham is..."It is my opinion that the Black vote in Durham is driven by the Democratic Party machine. I think they are instructed to pull the "straight Democrat" lever so they do it. They trust the party leaders that are telling them what to do."<br /><br />Party leaders? Like this guy?:<br />"This goes to show that justice can't be bought by a bunch of rich white boys from New York," said Harris Johnson, a former state Democratic party official and Durham resident for 56 years.<br /><br />"Duke has a habit of sweeping things under the carpet. I guess this goes to show that no matter how much money you have, Durham is owned by its citizens," he added.<br /><br />Will they be instructed to pull the “guilty” lever as well?Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-32542246.post-11093060015517179832006-11-09T10:55:00.000-05:002006-11-09T10:55:00.000-05:0010:22am anonymous, I am the 9:44am poster.
As far...10:22am anonymous, I am the 9:44am poster.<br /><br />As far as "tell it to the grand jury": your naivete as far as <a href="http://www.edwardjayepstein.com/archived/grand_jury_print.htm">indicted sandwiches</a> is touching.<br /><br />Within your reach are dozens of fully-sourced articles showing how the prosecution of the Duke Lacrosse Rape Case has been conducted for reasons of personal gain and electoral demagoguery, and how the prosecution is supported for reasons of personal gain, demagoguery, and Social Justice--but not Criminal Justice.<br /><br />I could link to these articles, but why bother--they are the posts at <a href="http://durhamwonderland.blogspot.com/">this very blog!</a> <br /><br />10:22am anonymous, here is a simple challenge. Provide a link to one--<b>one</b>--reputable article, dealing in <i>facts</i> and <i>supported by links to its claimed source material</i> that presents a credible case:<br /><br />(1) That the crimes of rape, kidnapping, or assault were committed the night of March 13th; <br /><br />and if so, that<br /><br />(2) Evidence exists that implicates the three accused men in these crimes.<br /><br />(If you want to (3) rebut the evidence of massive prosecutorial and police misconduct, then so much the better.)<br /><br />If you won't meet this simple request (and you can't, of course), then I don't know why you wrote in to disagree with me.<br /><br />Recall, my claim is that folks like you view this case subjectively as a Question of Social Justice, and not as a Criminal Justice matter where the facts of the case would be paramount.AMachttps://www.blogger.com/profile/08872008617279528583noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-32542246.post-22622366856048723112006-11-09T10:43:00.000-05:002006-11-09T10:43:00.000-05:00just realized I directed my post to the wrong post...just realized I directed my post to the wrong poster...it was for the 10:22 poster...Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-32542246.post-89329040643953303722006-11-09T10:37:00.000-05:002006-11-09T10:37:00.000-05:00To 10:22 are you really going to say that the gran...To 10:22 are you really going to say that the grand jury is your reason to beleive a crime actually took place. The grnad jury indicted these men on the word of a fungus and a flawed line-up. All Nifong had to do is get-up and say we have a "victim" that has identified these three men. There you go you have now gotten an indictment. <br /><br />To the attroneies/law professors on this blog I have a legal question for you. Can Nifing be held accountable for the flawed line-up, in that matter is that not lying to the grand jury to say she identified her attackers when she took a multiple choice test with no wrong asnwers.Philliphttps://www.blogger.com/profile/10332574179155298065noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-32542246.post-91553520907224720742006-11-09T10:31:00.000-05:002006-11-09T10:31:00.000-05:009:44, you'll have to come up with a better excuse ...9:44, you'll have to come up with a better excuse than the grand jury indicting...if that's the best you can do, well, it's pretty pathetic...just like this POS case...Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-32542246.post-69802810699314081502006-11-09T10:22:00.000-05:002006-11-09T10:22:00.000-05:009:44 am poster, you say there was no evidence of a...9:44 am poster, you say there was no evidence of a crime. well tell that to the grand jury that indicted all three. the only ones who want special treatment are the duke 3 who do not want to stand trial.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-32542246.post-63684467815609736042006-11-09T10:20:00.000-05:002006-11-09T10:20:00.000-05:00KC,
i was referring to the 8:22 am poster's post ...KC,<br /><br />i was referring to the 8:22 am poster's post in which he said it was disgusting for nifong to use the Nccu students. that is why i am saying that it is hypocritical as the duke students were heavily involved with the cheek effort.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-32542246.post-79612440270627244662006-11-09T09:50:00.000-05:002006-11-09T09:50:00.000-05:00As a white man, I again find it neccesary to thank...As a white man, I again find it neccesary to thank God this morning that I no longer live in Durham.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-32542246.post-5132007583715286112006-11-09T09:44:00.001-05:002006-11-09T09:44:00.001-05:007:41am anonymous wrote:
black people here want a ...7:41am anonymous wrote:<br /><br /><i>black people here want a trial, but not necessarily a conviction. they will not convict if there is no evidence but many feel the whole truth will come out only in court as the state's case has not all come out. they know only what the defense has leaked and held a press conference on and they do not buy that as the only version of events... do not intrepret the election to mean the black community wants to lynch the duke 3, they just want a trial and the only person who wants a trial is nifong so they supported him.</i><br /><br />8:35am anonymous wrote:<br /><br /><i>it is hypocritical and racist thinking like yours that started the racial tensions to start with in durham. nifong did not create anything that was not already there. the nccu students always help out the democratic voting efforts and they have been doing this for decades, unlike the really selfish-i-dont-give-a-damn-about-durham duke students.</i><br /><br />Thanks to (both of?) you for writing. What you say and what you don't say are both very illuminating as far as the motives and mind-set of the pro-Nifong, pro-trial crowd.<br /><br />I've never been to Durham, but from afar, it's been possible to follow this case closely, by three means:<br /><br />1. through reading online editions of the N&O, H-S, Duke Chronicle, NYT, and by watching '60 Minutes.'<br /><br />2. by reading blogs and online essays, notably by KC Johnson, John-in-Carolina, Liestoppers, William Anderson, and Cash Michaels.<br /><br />3. by examining case documents and informed commentary at TalkLeft.<br /><br />This entire episode is about three men charged by D.A. Nifong with felonies on the night of 3/13/06: assault, kidnapping, and rape.<br /><br />From the three sources listed above, what is the credible evidence that the crimes might have plausibly occurred? <i>There is none.</i><br /><br />If--amazingly--the rape happened: what's the credible evidence that the three accused men are the culprits? <i>There is none.</i><br /><br />What's the evidence of repeated and outrageous prosecutorial and police misconduct? <i>It is overwhelming.</i><br /><br />The astonishing fact is this: those who root for DA Nifong and cry "try those men!" have offered no rebuttals to the positions offered immediately above (no evidence of a crime, no suggestion of guilt of the accused, massive misconduct). The tales told on the pages of the H-S and NYT wither when exposed to sunlight.<br /><br />7:41am and 8:35am, you are not interested in criminal justice. You skip over the facts of the case. It's <i>Social Justice</i> you care about. <a href="http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Jim_Crow_laws">Nothing new</a> there <a href="http://www.olimu.com/Notes/CorrectEnglish.htm">(Who? Whom?)</a>. In that, you ably, if disgracefully, present the point of view that carried Durham's most important election on Tuesday.AMachttps://www.blogger.com/profile/08872008617279528583noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-32542246.post-2063940825410225822006-11-09T09:44:00.000-05:002006-11-09T09:44:00.000-05:00I have just come to an interesting development abo...I have just come to an interesting development about myself, I AM A RACIST, I believe these young men are not guilty of anything but having poor judgement about hiring a stripper. However stupid my relevation about be a racist is, it does not compare to be labeled one on several different pro-victim blogs (sorry for not linking them but too many to link) for the reason that I bring up evidence they cannot explain away. When I say they cannot explain away; that doesn't mean they have not tried, oh how they have tried. The best retort (sarcasm intentional) they can come up with is "She is a beatiful black woman and I believe her cause women don't lie bout rape" <br /><br />As for the election results I hope for the sake of irony that one of Nifungus's most devout supporters' son or daughter enters the Durham I don't care about evidence system where they can be held without bond (how many of the Nihilist supporters could have afforded the $400,000 bond or assuming the bail bondsmen in durham are the same as here $40,000 ) for a crime that did not happen.Philliphttps://www.blogger.com/profile/10332574179155298065noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-32542246.post-25399451983598166682006-11-09T09:24:00.000-05:002006-11-09T09:24:00.000-05:00It doesn't matter what the community wants, what D...It doesn't matter what the community wants, what Durham blacks want, how a trial will be closure for them, etc. The ONLY thing that matters are Reade Seligmann, Collin Finnerty, and Dave Evans being treated FAIRLY...is this a legitimate case? NO, it is not...end of question, case closed...it needs to be dismissed, pronto, and I'm so sorry, but if Durham blacks, or Duke professors, or anyone else has a problem with that, well, they'd best deal with it...they'd best do some soul-searching (if they have souls) and ask themselves WHY they feel so strongly that this bogus, outrageous persecution should lead to a trial.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.com