tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-32542246.post3973759390941168700..comments2024-02-24T05:19:10.949-05:00Comments on Durham-in-Wonderland: Upholding "Separate-but-Equal" Justicekcjohnson9http://www.blogger.com/profile/09625813296986996867noreply@blogger.comBlogger95125tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-32542246.post-22514073702951334922007-05-23T04:48:00.000-04:002007-05-23T04:48:00.000-04:00Kc, bill anderson and a lot of the posters on here...Kc, bill anderson and a lot of the posters on here are ridiculous with this separate and equal nonsense. there is a long history here of duke students getting off lightly for drug charges; just the last two weeks a duke student mailed several pounds of MJ to himself and got off with just probation; young black durhamites get time for those type of offenses. the dukies are usually treated lightly; the only reason that there was a change in policy and a get tough attitude with the duke students was at the request of the affluent folks in the trinity park neighborhood who had had to suffer from the boorish out of control behavior of these students. the students did not respond to previous efforts to police the area and the result was the crackdown and subsequent arrests. you guys are acting like the dpd woke up and decided to oppress duke students but the fact is that the students have a long history of transgressing in the neighborhood and the town and people down here are into law and order, especially around affluent white neighborhoods like trinity park. these problems have been well documented by the local papers and is the reason duke was buying the houses and renting them out in the first place. that is also the reason no one is upset over the so called revelations that dpd may have treated the students more harshly; everyone here knows about the past problems and agrees with the crackdown. gottlieb is seen as a hero here in trinity park. most of us here do not loose much sleep over a crackdown on drunken public urinators bringing down our property values. dont lose too much sleep waiting for the people of durham to protest that policy.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-32542246.post-25944116131487475682007-05-22T09:48:00.000-04:002007-05-22T09:48:00.000-04:005:05: Then clearly you don't understand basic sta...5:05: Then clearly you don't understand basic statistics and science. This is how and why so many people are fooled by manipulators like the G88. I believe that the phrase "dazzle them with BS" is apropos for those folks.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-32542246.post-13123505313570407012007-05-22T05:05:00.000-04:002007-05-22T05:05:00.000-04:00I am not a stat major or a math major, but I know ...I am not a stat major or a math major, but I know that 8% and 2% are not the same and can not be a wash.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-32542246.post-52761581100894113652007-05-21T23:22:00.000-04:002007-05-21T23:22:00.000-04:009:07 and 10:32: Without knowing what the variance...9:07 and 10:32: Without knowing what the variance in the data is, we personally can't say whether or not the 10% difference is a wash vis-a-vis <B>statistically significant</B> difference, i.e., different than zero - only the researcher who had the data can make this determination. And according to Braver, who actually analyzed the data, the difference was indeed a wash, as in "it disappeared." <BR/><BR/>Math major? Maybe. Statistician? Surely not. <BR/><BR/> For me, I'll trust the guy who actually did the research to make that call. But hey, you think you know better than the researcher who actually analyzed the data? Ok, whatever - keep dreaming. Whatever maintains your faith.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-32542246.post-34878968259946580762007-05-21T22:37:00.000-04:002007-05-21T22:37:00.000-04:00Mac, why do always object so harshly when I don’t ...Mac, why do always object so harshly when I don’t completely buy into your assertions, and why must you always respond in such a condescending, mean spirited way? This little exchange began when I responded to your declaration: “What's happening at Duke is a symptom of a disease. There's an outbreak-(call in the CDC!) -and almost an epidemic. You don't abandon one patient in the vain hopes of curing it in another who carries the same bug: you stop it where it lives. Duke could be saved, and it should.” <BR/><BR/>I offered my opinion that the patient does not consider itself diseased, nor does it want any help. Several exchanges followed, in one of which you clearly stated that many people feel the need to save Duke, regardless of how it became so sick. All I have been trying to ascertain is why, why do you, presumably, as well as others, feel this need so strongly? Alumni? Local residents of Durham that can appreciate the benefits that a major university can have on its local community? I am not a fan of Duke, that much I have made clear, and Duke has chosen to go the way it has, which it is free to do. I do not care that you make suggestions to Duke, but, actually, you’re not. You are making them on a chat board, where their value is questionable. That is why it would be helpful to me, and perhaps others, if you could give a more substantive reply as to why you feel this university must be saved, and how you intend to do. And try not to lace all your posts with such pithy, backhanded remarks. I don’t believe any of my posts contained any combative or derisive remarks directed at you.Jackhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/16530476676444348404noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-32542246.post-19364958474982533612007-05-21T22:32:00.000-04:002007-05-21T22:32:00.000-04:00Thanks math major. Not a wash by any means.Thanks math major. Not a wash by any means.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-32542246.post-49162965051694086842007-05-21T21:07:00.000-04:002007-05-21T21:07:00.000-04:003:13 pm and 4:13 pmThat it a 10% difference - not ...3:13 pm and 4:13 pm<BR/><BR/>That it a 10% difference - not 6%.<BR/><BR/>Math major here.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-32542246.post-32710808406097477492007-05-21T21:01:00.000-04:002007-05-21T21:01:00.000-04:00Jack,Certainly not up to me to "save"Duke. And i...Jack,<BR/><BR/>Certainly not up to me to "save"<BR/>Duke. And it's not up to you<BR/>to tell anyone not to offer <BR/>free advice, nor to question<BR/>why we should care about Duke's<BR/>future.<BR/><BR/>I guessed right that you wouldn't<BR/>look at what Duke contributes<BR/>to society with regard to science<BR/>and medical research and all<BR/>that, but I'm not your guardian.<BR/><BR/>So why should you care if I<BR/>make suggestions to Duke? <BR/>Do you want to make improvements <BR/>to the DIW "Mac" model? <BR/>How is that YOUR responsibility?machttps://www.blogger.com/profile/14248016116043347912noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-32542246.post-52437905172360244832007-05-21T21:00:00.000-04:002007-05-21T21:00:00.000-04:00I am the parent of a Duke student. And I am becom...I am the parent of a Duke student. And I am becoming more and more concerned as the administrative bungling and incompetence on the part Duke's leaders is exposed.<BR/><BR/>So - what to do - recommend leaving Duke? Or not? I am pissed that I have to try and determine whether or not Duke's leaders will work to keep my kid safe, or be complicit is helping set them up for problems.<BR/><BR/>Clean it up guys - be professional, and do the right things for the right reason.<BR/><BR/>And I thought Animal Houses' Dean Wormer was fictional.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-32542246.post-14365930733762177932007-05-21T20:39:00.000-04:002007-05-21T20:39:00.000-04:00It's entirely reasonable that, after divorce, men'...It's entirely reasonable that, after divorce, men's living standards ON AVERAGE increase and women's decline. Or, if the living standards of both decline, that men's living standards decline less than women's. It simply reflects that, after divorce, both parties tend to revert to their pre-marriage standard of living. And, on average, like it or not, men as a class earn more than women.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-32542246.post-19641826005465695282007-05-21T20:05:00.000-04:002007-05-21T20:05:00.000-04:00Mac, in your 11:20 post, you accuse me of not want...Mac, in your 11:20 post, you accuse me of not wanting to see Duke become a better place. That is a mischaracterization of the exchange we had on another thread, wherein I asked why it should be up to YOU to “save Duke”? There is no indication that Duke wants to be saved, that Duke feels it needs to be saved. As a private institution, Duke is free hire who they want, teach what they want. What is your stake in saving Duke? Are you from Durham? Are you a Duke graduate? If so, then I could understand your vested interest in the university establishing goals, following principles and ideals that have been absent in the way the school has conducted itself as respects the lacrosse players. I would have empathy for you and other alumni who feel so terrible about how the school they came of age in has transformed into something that now pains them. For local citizens, having a major university in the community has numerous cultural and economic benefits, although it appears Duke has skimped on it’s investment in local good will in recent years.<BR/><BR/>You say I should count up all the attributes of Duke University, so as to appreciate the value the school returns to society. Why? There are things about the school I do not like, so I choose not to support it, my kids will not go to school there. And guess what? Duke does not give a hoot about how I feel, or you for that matter. So, remember, I am stating it clearly: it is not that I do not want Duke to become a better place, it is that I am indifferent; I am not willing to invest myself emotionally in an institution that has chosen a path, philosophically, so very different from mine. KC Johnson staked a claim in this issue (forgive me if I am presumptuous, Professor) for three reasons: The injustice perpetrated by the governmental authorities against three innocent students; the horrendous behavior of the Duke faculty in their demonstration of contempt for their students (offended, in a professional sense by his [sic] peers); how all of these amazing, bewildering, infuriating, outrageous elements will provide KC with semesters worth of material for academic application. Oh, yeah, and the book. Well, everyone’s entitled to make a buck. <BR/><BR/>Institutions like Duke certainly do play an important role in society, something I can recognize. But your attitude is one I disagree with. Saving people from themselves! I’ve heard that before. We have a vast, overarching social services system that operates on that premise. How about General Motors? They need to be saved, they provide expansive direct and indirect economic benefits to society, and they are tottering on the brink. They made choices over the past 25 years to make more Hummers and Suburbans, more V-8 engines, lobby Washington to relax mileage requirements, safety standards, re-classify SUV’s to truck status. They are a private entity that did what was expedient to serve their own short term interests. They are now paying the price in falling sales, and soon may disappear from the American landscape. Do you want to save them, too?Jackhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/16530476676444348404noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-32542246.post-18015785983230960542007-05-21T19:54:00.000-04:002007-05-21T19:54:00.000-04:00I can't resist - PT Barnum said "There is one born...I can't resist - PT Barnum said "There is one born every minute."Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-32542246.post-55222672306501862862007-05-21T19:31:00.000-04:002007-05-21T19:31:00.000-04:005:23pm: Actually Braver's done quite a bit of wor...5:23pm: Actually Braver's done quite a bit of work in recent years, but given your obvious hostility to real facts and reason, I'll stop wasting my time and leave it to you to do your own homework. I cited that source deliberately because the data used was old and more comtemporaneous than more recent studies with Weitzman's now-discredited work. However, that important distinction obviously went right over you head. Still, it's quite telling that while we're dickering over my sources I'm still waiting for you to offer up even one legitimate, peer-reviewed citation for your claims. And so it goes.<BR/><BR/>Not a G88? Could have fooled me.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-32542246.post-90867430280297105292007-05-21T18:50:00.000-04:002007-05-21T18:50:00.000-04:00How anyone at Duke could defend DPD's work when th...How anyone at Duke could defend DPD's work when they managed to arrest three innocent Duke students for a crime that never happened is beyond me. With that sort of titanic screw-up on their record and their recent report whitewashing their own actions in that case it is tough to have any confidence in them at all.<BR/><BR/>All of this is just compounded by Duke's acceptance of a DPD policy that allows for more severe punishment of it's own students than other local residents. Is Duke taking the position that their students do not have the same civil rights as other residents of Durham? Maybe if DPD extended this policy to include Duke faculty and administrators people like Bryan might take a different view. As it stands it is completely baffling. Duke as an institution seems to have no concern for it's own students. They will accept the tuition checks of these same students though. No problem there.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-32542246.post-81246024121660494342007-05-21T17:54:00.000-04:002007-05-21T17:54:00.000-04:00I'm sick of hearing the word "privileged."Let's de...I'm sick of hearing the word "privileged."<BR/><BR/>Let's deconstruct it, shall we?<BR/><BR/>Source: American Heritage College Dictionary--<BR/><BR/>"Privileged"--2. Confined to an exclusive or chosen group of individuals.<BR/><BR/>"Privilege"--1a. A special advantage, immunity, permission, right, or benefit granted to or enjoyed by an individual, class, or caste. b. Such a privilege held as a prerogative of status or rank and exercised to the EXCLUSION OR DETRIMENT OF OTHERS. [emphasis added]<BR/><BR/>So, how have the lacrosse players utilized their "privilege" to the exclusion or detriment of others?<BR/><BR/>"Privileged," like "racism" or "sexism," is nothing but a word to attack "groups" who individually and as families contribute disproportionately to the prosperity of the world.<BR/><BR/>What the doofus 88 are really accusing the lacrosse players of is coming from functional families<BR/><BR/>PolanskiAnonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-32542246.post-10341515361529528302007-05-21T17:23:00.000-04:002007-05-21T17:23:00.000-04:00WTF - legitimate, peer-reviewed scientific circles...WTF - legitimate, peer-reviewed scientific circles in a Law Review. This is a blog. 1987 stats. Is this the best these guys could do? No, I am not an 88 Professor. I would think that was obvious. More improverished - well, that will put a crimp on their new swinging life.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-32542246.post-56631402182979187932007-05-21T16:52:00.000-04:002007-05-21T16:52:00.000-04:004:13, try using the citation to Family Law Quarter...4:13, try using the citation to <I>Family Law Quarterly</I> to find the article. That's how it's done in legitimate, peer-reviewed scientific circles. When/if you actually <I>read</I> the article you'll find the following in the conclusions: <BR/><BR/><I>"The present article used the author's own 1987 data set to examine the gap . Employing a method used by most previous researchers (the needs adjustment income technique), the gender gap in this sample approximated that of the remaining literature. However, after correcting the method for two matters not hitherto considered, unequal taxes and the sharing of the expenses of the children between the two parents' households, the gender gap was vanishingly small; it all but disappeared. There is reason to think that recent reforms of the child support guidelines has actually reversed the conventional wisdom: fathers in certain states may now be more impoverished by divorce than mothers. There is also reason to think that this tendency will worsen as longer term effects are assessed."</I><BR/><BR/>You seem to be very hostile to ideas that challenge your orthodoxy. Are you a member of the G88?Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-32542246.post-9113115482492446192007-05-21T16:34:00.000-04:002007-05-21T16:34:00.000-04:005:01 I sent letters, faxes and called the ACLU, Na...5:01 I sent letters, faxes and called the ACLU, Naacp and the Innocent Project requesting intervention. I know that multi thousands also did the same thing. Why - because they wrote in blogs that they did. I have no reason to believe this is not true, as bloggers, if nothing else, know how to mount a campaign. Please do not tell me, it takes a big shot to bring them in and not an ordinary citizen.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-32542246.post-1573805222894998512007-05-21T16:30:00.000-04:002007-05-21T16:30:00.000-04:00At least the team is smart enough, to not go one t...At least the team is smart enough, to not go one to one or group to black folk in Durham without witnesses.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-32542246.post-64592118282837656622007-05-21T16:15:00.000-04:002007-05-21T16:15:00.000-04:00***Your comments are meant to be a diversion back ...***Your comments are meant to be a diversion back to the old worn out issues of racism.***<BR/><BR/>No, my comments were in response to the poster who said that white men have it the worst in the justice system. That IS an insane statement.<BR/><BR/>***It doesn't happen to whites more often? <BR/><BR/>Well, actually it happens to poor people more often. The issue is poverty and all the sorrows associated with poverty.***<BR/><BR/>Fine, the issue is poverty, and demographics/socioeconomic realities are... demographics and socioeconomic realities. The way society is structured, minorities are the ones with the least money, and hence have it the worst in the justice system. Not sure you are defending that guy's comments that I was attacking, as you have stated you believe that poverty is the leading cause of injustice (ironically, also something that has nothing to do with the wealthy defendants in the Duke case).<BR/><BR/>***The anti-poverty advocates of many years ago have now taken jobs at Universities where there is no poverty!<BR/><BR/>They don't know what to do with themselves except create problems to solve...such as rape and sexual assault.***<BR/><BR/>I wouldn't say that these "former anti-poverty advocates" have "created rape and sexual assault". Those things are real, whether or not they occurred in the Duke case (which we all know didn't happen). You are right that they thought "one of their own oppressed" was the victim of a crime by wealthy lax players, and thats why they pounced on it. Great work, Captain obvious (we knew this already)!<BR/><BR/>***It makes about as much sense to offer programs at Duke University to combat rape for example as it does to offer program to help students combat Alzheimer's disease in the resident halls.***<BR/><BR/>I gather that rapes happen more often on college campuses like Duke than do cases of early-onset Alzheimer's. Far more. <BR/><BR/>***The G88 needs to work with anti-poverty programming in Durham if they want to hone their anti-poverty advocating skills.***<BR/><BR/>They do still do anti-poverty work, whether you love 'em or hate 'em (and I don't like 'em one bit either, but that doesn't mean honesty and common sense go out the door).<BR/><BR/>***The maniacs are those who are consciously creating problems in places where there are none.***<BR/><BR/>Those professors are a$$holes and overreacted to an alleged crime against a minority student allegedly perpetuated by wealthy privileged lax players. Again, congratulations Captain Obvious. They were wrong and did the wrong thing. Not sure their motives were evil, but the result to these boys was pure evil. Regardless, they are not the issue...<BR/><BR/>THE SOLE ISSUE WAS RESPONDING TO THAT IDIOT'S REMARK ABOUT HOW WHITE MEN ARE TREATED UNFAIRLY!!!Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-32542246.post-20533094587845912222007-05-21T16:13:00.000-04:002007-05-21T16:13:00.000-04:002% to 8% does not look like a wash to me. Accordin...2% to 8% does not look like a wash to me. According to your stats that is a 6% difference. How about you reducing your income by 8%, see how you like it. Plus be the primary care giver. Bravo Sierra. I don't agree with your stats and can't access your link.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-32542246.post-11127265140087988152007-05-21T16:01:00.000-04:002007-05-21T16:01:00.000-04:003:13 said: "No, not true. Many studies on this iss...3:13 said: <I>"No, not true. Many studies on this issue do not support your statement."</I><BR/><BR/>Such as?<BR/><BR/>A very good analysis conducted by Sanford Braver, who took into account such things as taxes paid by fathers on income used for child support, tax-free payment to mothers such as child support, etc., showed men's increase in standard of living going up a 'whopping' 2% and mothers going down an equally 'whopping' 8%. Statistically it was a wash. <BR/><BR/>See <A HREF="http://www.pacegroup.org/flq.pdf" REL="nofollow">The Gender Gap in Standard of Living<BR/>After Divorce : Vanishingly Small?"</A> SL Braver, <I>Family Law Quarterly</I>, 1999 for just one of many examples of a more fair and accurate analysis of this non-issue.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-32542246.post-22596784360741684802007-05-21T15:57:00.000-04:002007-05-21T15:57:00.000-04:00Anonymous 9:16 said... ...You people are insane. T...Anonymous 9:16 said... <BR/><BR/>...You people are insane. This type of injustice happens to one race much more often than the other. I'll give you a hint: it doesn't happen to whites more often.<BR/><BR/>...Most of the posters here are maniacs! <BR/>::<BR/>Your comments are meant to be a diversion back to the old worn out issues of racism. <BR/><BR/>It doesn't happen to whites more often? <BR/><BR/>Well, actually it happens to poor people more often. The issue is poverty and all the sorrows associated with poverty.<BR/><BR/>The anti-poverty advocates of many years ago have now taken jobs at Universities where there is no poverty!<BR/><BR/>They don't know what to do with themselves except create problems to solve...such as rape and sexual assault. <BR/><BR/>It makes about as much sense to offer programs at Duke University to combat rape for example as it does to offer program to help students combat Alzheimer's disease in the resident halls. <BR/><BR/>The G88 needs to work with anti-poverty programming in Durham if they want to hone their anti-poverty advocating skills.<BR/><BR/>The maniacs are those who are consciously creating problems in places where there are none.<BR/>::<BR/>GPGary Packwoodhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/05177986821224068759noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-32542246.post-90037353550195437092007-05-21T15:29:00.000-04:002007-05-21T15:29:00.000-04:00I was born liberated. I do not support the marxist...I was born liberated. I do not support the marxist feminist at all. Just go into any fast food place on Friday and see the tired working woman with their kids, trying to take care of them. That is why I think the woman should dump these kids on the father. The woman can do the every other saturday afternoon visits..Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-32542246.post-24300136784620601002007-05-21T15:13:00.000-04:002007-05-21T15:13:00.000-04:001:42 - No, not true. Many studies on this issue do...1:42 - No, not true. Many studies on this issue do not support your statement.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.com