Thursday, December 28, 2006

The Complaint

Some quick reactions, with more detailed analysis to follow.

1.) This filing is the beginning of the end of Nifong’s career as Durham D.A.

The filing focuses solely on his procedurally improper public statements, which the Bar (correctly) contends violated Rule 3.8(f) of the Code of Professional Responsibility. That provision requires prosecutors to “refrain from making extrajudicial comments that have a substantial likelihood of heightening public condemnation of the accused.”

Importantly, the bar complaint also alleges that Nifong’s violations of 3.8(f) were of such magnitude that they ran afoul of Rule 8.4(c) and Rule 8.4(d), which state that prosecutors cannot “engage in conduct involving dishonesty, fraud, deceit or misrepresentation”; or “engage in conduct that is prejudicial to the administration of justice.”

2.) There is no reason to believe that the bar will not take other actions against Nifong.

The bar surely would have to consider filing an ethics complaint against Nifong for his conspiracy with Dr. Brian Meehan to hide the exculpatory evidence; given the recent nature of this revelation, no public filing on this matter could occur at this stage.

Also, the bar would at least have to consider ethics complaints on issues relating to Nifong’s ordering the police to violate their own procedures in the flawed April 4 lineup. Yet it would be unlikely that a complaint would be filed as long as the matter is pending before Judge Smith.

3.) The bar dismisses Nifong’s canard that Rule 3.8(f) applied only once he had obtained charges against Reade Seligmann and Collin Finnerty.

First, the complaint notes that many of Nifong’s procedurally improper statements occurred after charges were filed.

Second, the complaint correctly reasons that nothing in the wording of Rule 3.8(f) suggests that it applies only after indictments have been obtained, rather than (as occurred here) once suspects have been identified.

4.) The 17-page complaint—the ethics equivalent of an indictment—is detailed.

The bar contends that Nifong’s improper statements affected the proper administration of justice in at least six ways:

Improper commentary on the lacrosse players’ invocation of their constitutional rights;
Improper commentary on the evidence to be presented in the case;
Improper commentary about the guilt of the accused;
Improperly using hypothetical comments to explain away the existence of exculpatory evidence;
Improper commentary about the “character, credibility, and reputation of the accused”;
Improperly making statements that heightened public condemnation of the accused.

5.) One set of these violations was worse than all the others.

“Nifong engaged in conduct involving dishonesty, fraud, deceit, or misrepresentation” in his speculation that a condom might have been used, when he knew or should have known that the accuser had explicitly stated that her alleged assailants did not use condoms.

6.) It’s hard to see how Nifong can remain on the case when he is a defendant on ethics charges growing out of his conduct in the case.


Anonymous said...

from a non-lawyer: It is hard to imagine Nifong stepping aside from the Duke case voluntarily. So who will push him over the side? the current judge? And if another prosecutor is appointed, even getting up to speed takes time. So could these young men still be left hanging out there for months or will the Duke case be over quickly?

Anonymous said...

In North Carolina you can withhold evidence in a capital case and you only get a letter of reprimand. Nifong did far less but when your Defendants are rich with high profile lawyers, Nifong will be judged more harshly which is not fair. The only thing he has going for him is a black community who does not have the courage to attack the victims lies simply because of her race and their disdain for Duke.

The whole legal system in NC is a joke and Im often ashamed to be a member of the State Bar in NC.

The Dude said...

Nifong painted himself into a corner. what a dumb ass! he made these statements which can be verifed. His own discovery shows the statements are not true. Game over but plenty more to come against Nifong. Wait until the civil suit begins. Duke U., Group of 88 are sweating bullets. Time to pay the piper.

Anonymous said...

KC: could you post the complaint itself? Thanks.

Anonymous said...

Finally, the justice system is beginning to work. Let us hope it works fast and well. These are the days we have all been waiting for!

Anonymous said...

from a non-lawyer: another quick comment. What happens to a sitting DA when he is being brought up on charges? Is the DA placed on administrative leave (probably paid) pending the resolution of the ethics charges? Clearly a sitting DA facing ethics charges has implications for all the cases within their jurisdiction.

Anonymous said...

The Civil Suit is going to cost the State of NC a ton of money and the State Bar who disciplines their lawyers is going to disbar Nifong.

What bothers me is that no matter how poorly Nifong acted, the victim lied and made up a story because she hates whtes and Duke yet there is no outrage in the community. The double standard in society continues to grow as imagine if a rich white kid raped some coed from NC Central.

We should be attacking the victim and cut off her Medicaid.

yportne said...

I first heard this wonderful news while listening to streaming audio of your Boston radio presentation. You were perfect. I particularly enjoyed the discussion about the evil 88. Will a transcript become available?

Anonymous said...

Sorry I can't agree, Dude. I'll bet the 88 have a "What, me worry?" 'tude on tonight. Have you seen any evidence of rational behavior or an understanding of basic parameters on the part of anyone, excepting student Butler, Professor Coleman, and that dipdog rock perfesser who forgot to take his pills that one time? Duke is taking it to the end of the road on this one. The doors are welded shut and the pedal's to the metal. And the gas tank's on fire, uhhuh. sic semper tyrannis

Anonymous said...

When will someone now go after the accomplices in the Durham Police Department???

Anonymous said...

The so call "victim" just did not want to be locked up for being drunk.

Nifong and the police should have investigated not indict. No they have to pay.

Nifong at least did get what he wanted. He wanted this case to make him a national name. Well done.

Anonymous said...

I wondered if this set of charges against Nifong is related to the now dismissed rape charge and other charges would come against Nifong when the other charges in the case are dismissed?

Anonymous said...

Duke is a joke. The President should resign. He rushed to judgment the same way everyone else did to appease the black community. He didnt support the players and reserve judgment and shut down the lacrosse season. Why anyone would want to play ball at that school is beyond me.

Its amazing what a bunch of politically correct African appeasers will do to themselves instead of calling the victim what she is, a liar living off the government dole.

Anonymous said...

Maybe Nifong can get a job at Duke teaching ethics. They seem to have a low bar for faculty.

Anonymous said...

7:13 if you're ashamed to belong to NC State Bar then leave it. I seem to detect you have been protected by the NC Bar previously for possible misconduct.

Kemper said...

After posting for months that the Bar was going to act, I am finally glad that my drunk lawyer buddies didn't let me down. He is more than toast, he is DEAD MAN WALKING!

james conrad said...

cool beans

james conrad said...

cool beans

Anonymous said...

I just read the complaint. At the very end, the defendent will be taxed for all costs.

Got to love making Nifong pay for his own hearing!

Anonymous said...

This issue is bigger, much bigger than Nifong.

Ultimately, this is about the intellectual and moral culture that has been spawned by America's universities in general and the philosophy of multicultural liberalism in particular. This case could just as well have happened in Berkeley or Cambridge or New Haven.

Anonymous said...

The NC Bar may be trying to save face at this point, but I will be very surprised if anything of substance comes out of their investigation. Nifong gets his wrist slapped and lives to prosecute another day. Sad, but it's how the Bar covers each other's back side.

GPrestonian said...

7:14pm Anon:

Here's the Complaint

Anonymous said...

To Kemp at 7:31 - First of all, good call! Second, do you think other citations - such as his refusal to view exculpatory evidence, the flawed line-up, the withholding of exculpatory DNA findings - will be forthcoming? If so, any idea of a time frame?

Anonymous said...

The bar knows that if they let Nifong walk on these charges, They will be back with the lineup, not looking at the alibi, and the whole DNA mess as additional charges.

They will disbar him, or they will be having serial hearings.

Anonymous said...

To DOJ: Please direct your attention to item 43 in the 17 page complaint.

John Steele said...

I think that KC's analysis is strong. I, too, believe that an amended complaint is inevitable. This complaint, focusing just on public statements, was probably being drafted well before the recent testimony about the DNA report. My analysis is at the Legal Ethics Forum, here:

Victim in Massachusetts said...

Kemper 9:31 I need to say I'm sorry for not trusting you on this one. I am very uneasy about the legal profession.

You were right on off a few days.

bill anderson said...

The second comment is important, and I think it needs to be addressed. First, and most important, the Bar's reprimand to David Hoke and Debra Graves was widely protested as being much too light, and as a result of what the Bar did, the public outcry guaranteed the Bar would act more severely against future miscreants.

Second, the attorney making the comments basically seems to be saying that the only reason that Nifong is being judged is because of the race and wealth of the defendants and because the attorneys are high-profile. I would disagree.

The race, wealth, and the fact that the accused were Duke students made the case high-profile. Nifong chose to take advantage of all of that in order to win an election. Joe Cheshire and the others did not make Nifong utter the statements that now have him in trouble.

And this is not the end. This is the light stuff we are reading today. It will only get worse for Nifong, and I for one believe that he deserves what he is getting.

As a Christian, I am taught not to rejoice at the downfall of someone. However, I can rejoice that some justice is being done, and I will rejoice even more when the rest of the prosecutors of the United States realize that they are on notice, and that this is going to happen to one or more of them in the future. The Internet and motivated people are powerful tools in dealing with this trashing of the law that these prosecutors swear they will uphold.

Anonymous said...

111 - Looks like the Newsweek date rape lie.

theman said...

How do expect Nifong to do his job with all this outside pressure on him, he is trying to do his best to get convictions.

Anonymous said...

correction 11 date rape drug

Guaunyu said...

I have repeatedly said to folks that I did not believe the Bar would act.

This news is the best tasting bit of crow I've ever had the pleasure of eating. Delicious!

Anonymous said...

theman said: "How do expect Nifong to do his job with all this outside pressure on him"

It is because he *wasn't doing his job* that they now won't expect him to do his job.

Anonymous said...

I think that Sword of Justice said it best, except that I would argue that it is multicultural liberalisim in general that has blinded the justice system. Duke is a specific example of this. Yes, Nifong needs to go, but hopefully the President of Duke won't be far behind.

theman said...

You here are all nuts, the Fong will survive and the guilty will be found guilty. Nifong is a great DA, the kind we need in Durham now.

rabbi-philosopher said...

To: theman

It appears that even theman is giving up hope that the Dookies will serve time for their terrible crime against the pure virginity of Crystal what's her name.

Maybe she'll run for Mayor of Durham next. She should get the votes!

Anonymous said...

Question for Attorneys - Would Nifong avoid any liabiity or penalties if he decided not to be sworn in on January 2nd ?

affirmative action said...

Nifong is but a symptom, Brodhead and the 88 are the disease. It's up to the Duke alumni/benefactor network to get rid of Brodhead and all non-tenured 88s (almost all are not tenured, I believe).

Destroying Nifong is a good start but a long way from addressing the social cancer of which the modern liberal academy is a leading cause.

An attorney said...

No, he could still suffer the penalty of disbarment unless he voluntarily surrendered his license to practice.

Anonymous said...

It's a shame that some folks still decry the "rich with high profile lawyers" angle in this case. The defendants are fortunate that they were able to hire competent attorneys even though they're unlikely to ever be reimbursed for the cost of having to deal with false accusations. Imagine what would happen to anyone in Durham, NC charged with a crime who could not afford an attorney. The defendants plight has also been exacerbated by the fact that their President chose to leave them hanging for far too long.

Anonymous said...

not be reimbursed for the cost of their lawyers? are you kidding?
The civil suit will likely make the accused millionaires long before they inherit their parents money.

E said...

Non lawyer here. I am curious about the timing of this complaint. Why now? It seems that they are saying that the complaint began last spring. Why would they bring it forth at this point? Why not sooner? Could it be due to their own liability? Are complaints such as this usually brought forth like this?

Anonymous said...

Theman is some real sick parrot or he is the DPD stirring the pot ?

Anonymous said...

Are there any grounds on which the Duke 3 can sue Duke University (e.g., Brodhead and the Gang of 88)?

Cedarford said...

I wish several posters would stop being played as schnooks by the poster "theman" who is not a serious poster who means what they say, but a troll who thinks it is clever to dangle bait of one sentence of provocative words - repeatedly - that gullible people snap at.

As you respond to him, you might as well write in your response "I am too stupid to get the sucker's game he is playing on several Blogs every day."

Ignore the twerp.

Anonymous said...

I guess the thing to do would be to go over their
public statements looking
for slander and libel.

Perhaps the 88 get fired as
part of a settlement.

Probably too early for that. But I'm sure that
there will be folks on the internet going through that exercise.

GPrestonian said...

7:57pm John Steele:

Thank you, John. Good analysis!

theman said...

cederfart you be a twerp

Anonymous said...

poster # 2 at 7:13 pm & Nifong are on the same page. A tad envious of Duke.

Anonymous said...

Beating a dead horse, but

in his speculation that a condom might have been used, when he knew or should have known that the accuser had explicitly stated that her alleged assailants did not use condoms.

Compounded by the fact she can't even be sure she was penetrated now, she explicitly stated a condom wasn't used?

This case is beyond belief. My bet is on Nifong entering rehab soon.

Anonymous said...

the amazing thing to me that nifong really seems to be very, very stupid. if you just look at the chronology of his statemetns, there's no way he could argue that he misunderstood.

at first i thought he was really arrogant, but then the way he kept stumbling over himself with three different excuses for not turning over the dna after meehan outed him was, well, really almost sad. talk about someone in over their head intellectually, that clearly happens in a shallow pool for nifong.

but back to the gang of 88. so, i want to know what the punishment will be for blacks, sine karla holloway said it herself that white innocence means black guilt. now, its time to start talking about that. the mlk dream is dead, no more of that. its a new day for america.

happy kwanzaa,


Anonymous said...

Liefong will go off deep-end before this is over. His behavior is typical.

Anonymous said...

why would anyone be envious of a school that only promotes the achievements of its individuals and entities while distancing itself from any potential adversity that may exist for the same. Not a school id want to be a part of.

Anonymous said...

if nothing else this case should show us all that the rich get better representation then the poor and the misconduct of the police is rampant. I guess this is the trade that the rich must pay for because they are targets of the poor who are looking for a money grab with no consequences should their lies be exposed.

The sad thing is that we still focus on the overblown injustices of race and not economics, which is the real determination of whether you can afford justice.

Anonymous said...

"I'm not going to let Durham's view in the minds of the world to be a bunch of lacrosse players from Duke raping a black girl in Durham."

Nifong was sucessful.

Now the world has a different view of Durham.

Kemper said...

One point, this grievance was originally made in Oct. It was suggested to me that the complaint would be delayed to include the DNA lies, but there was no time, so the catch all final charge was added. That doesn't stop the committee from considering new charges.

Anonymous said...

Have a Happy New Year!

Anonymous said...

where is the outrage at the accuser who just made up a bunch of crap.

Anonymous said...

Hey, is the ground SHAAAAAAKING yet?

GPrestonian said...

8:27pm 'E':

Why now, you ask?

As you pointed out, these statements happened quite some time ago, and the Bar obviously has been watching closely since then.

My thinking is that the Dec 15 DNA hearing was the tipping point for this complaint. All of these statements belong in the defense's Change of Venue motion (and most probably are), and perhaps the Bar thought that the effect of the statements would be 'cured' by the granting of a COV. That doesn't mean that the statements didn't break the rules in & of themselves, but I suspect that the Bar was willing to wait until the case was over to file on these charges alone.

Then comes the Meehan testimony, and it became obvious to them that this simply couldn't go on any longer - no more waiting for Judge Smith to rule, etc.

Tipping point, straw that broke the camel's back - choose your cliche, in the immortal words of Garland Green. ;>)

The Bar finally had had enough after Meehan's stunning testimony, and filed the only complaint they had completed at this point. The line-up, the hiding of the exculpatory DNA evidence, the refusal to consider or even listen to Seligman's alibi - all those are fodder for an ammended or 2nd complaint.

Anonymous said...

8:55 ask Nifong and Gottlieb of DPD.

emmy said...

9:06, have you been paying attention??!! Many of us are EQUALLY outraged with Precious...she is equally culpable, imo...the whole POS case *started* with her...and she has allowed this travesty to continue all these months...she gets no pass from me!

I also agree that there is more to come from the bar...consider, they have been on Nifong's case since the end of March, and are only now getting to the extrajudicial statements from him (which imo are more than enough to get him disbarred) will take them some time to get to the other charges, such as the ignoring of exculpatory evidence of Reade's, and the outrageous suppression of exculpatory evidence from will surely be coming!

AGhostfromthepast said...

Hay you all they have a song already writen for Nifong it goes like this:
Na, na, na,/ Na, na, na, Hay, hay, goodbye
Does anyone remember that song? I am sure Mikey remembers that.

GS said...

Imanagine the video clip of Nifong swearing in on January 2nd. I can see the SNL take on it already.

Seriously what judge is going to want to be in that video clip on TV!

Anonymous said...

Nifong must be strumming his guitar and singing "I DID IT MY WAY" Frank Sinatra


Anonymous said...

What, ethics rules apply during an election campaign? No be serious.

- Nifong to Bar

wayne fontes said...

If Nifong beats this complaint it will be the greatest piece of lawyering since Aaron Burr beat the charges against him.

Mikey has yet demonstrate he has it in him.

Don said...

Perhaps the timing has something to do with the swearing in next week. I am sure the NC bar does not want to see that happen.

Anonymous said...

Speaking of swearing in, why the heck the the NC state bar wait until after the Nov. 7 election? They have been mulling over these issues since April and certainly could have acted sooner if they had wanted to. Was it the possible criminal act of withholding exculpatory evidence that put them over the top? The simple fact that no Duke DNA was found in or on the accuser, but that of several other males was? And, of course, the charge that "now defendant" Nifong "allegedly" conspired to hide this incredibly relevant evidence from the public, from the defendants, and perhaps not least of all, from his own voting constituents, the good people of Durham.

Anonymous said...

How can Nifong say he is not wedded to this case now? One of three things will happen:

1 - Nifong asks for a special prosecutor.

2 - Nfong assigns the case to someone in his office.

3 - The judge removes Nifong from the case

Anonymous said...

"One of three things will happen"

Actually, there is another item, which brings your list to four things.

Nifong might have a nervous break down. Perhaps he is on the verge now, maybe some doctors can chime in and comment if his behavior is indicative of someone about to have a break down.

I hope he does NOT have one, for that is not something I'd wish on anybody.

Anonymous said...

Well he could always resign.

ec said...

I hope he does NOT have one (a nervous breakdown), for that is not something I'd wish on anybody.

That is just your compassion and humanity speaking. Most of us are decent people and do not wish harm on others. You have to remember that the Fong had no problem sleeping at night knowing that he may send 3 innocent young men to prison for 30 years. If anyone deserves a nervous breakdown or worse, it is that POS.

Anonymous said...

"Well he could always resign."

Several reasons that likely won't happen:
1. He is too stubborn
2. His election was about "him", yup, there is an ego, just look at the way he walks and holds his head. He literally looks down on people.
3. His election was also about continuance of health insurance. Perhaps many have forgot...he has a preexisting condition and likely won't be covered for that by his next employer.

Anonymous said...

Can the governor pardon Nifong, a la Ford for nixon?

Where would that leave a civil suit?

Anonymous said...

"If anyone deserves a nervous breakdown or worse, it is that POS."

Me thinks garnishment of his wages to repay all LAX legal bills plus damages would be far more fitting...

Anonymous said...

The gov could not pardon federal civil rights issues. And a pardon does not rule out civil judgements.

Anonymous said...

This case is beyond belief. My bet is on Nifong entering rehab soon.

8:42 PM

I agree...

does anyone think it is possible he won't be allowed to swear in?

Cedarford said...

Anonymous - Theman is some real sick parrot or he is the DPD stirring the pot ?

As I said, "theman" is a twerp playing a game here and trying to goad suckers here and on several other Blogs who don't get his little game to respond. Sadly, Bill Anderson is one of the suckered.

To understand his modus operandi, he rights a one-line sentence of raw stupidity several times in any blog thread along extremist lines, and done in "ebonics" - because he is a little white twerp who thinks of himself as rather clever and amusing in his ability to goad people into wasting time responding to him by playing the troll...but he isn't too smart since no black person who uses ebonic speech patterns when excited or yakkin' with other brothers consciously writes in an ebonic style.

An example:

cederfart you be a twerp

and another:

Fong be da real man. He be the DA Durham needs

Again, no black person writes like that, only little white twerps faking being black and baaaaaad.

Ignore him.

Anyone that responds to the jerk's bait is a de facto sucker and his bitch.

GPrestonian said...

10:10pm Anon:

What's his preexisting condition?

duke09parent said...


Honor is due, my friend, honor is due. I'm sorry we doubted you.

My take on the timing is that the Bar guys were pissed that Nifong did not dismiss the whole case, so went ahead with the complaint they had prepared, in order to get started at the mid-January meeting as Kemper predicted and to try to push the prosecution to resolution.

The more serious offense is the hiding of the exculpatory evidence. Ironically, since the defense smoked it out well before any trial date, the attempt to hide it might not be enough by itself to dismiss the case, though enough to disbar the offender.

I remember reading somewhere that Nutfong needed to be employed into 2007 to qualify for his pension. He's not likely to take this complaint lying down anyway.

Anonymous said...


Find a judge who wants to be forever assosiated with Nifong?
He better not run for office. I could see the picture of him standing next to Nifong being a political problem.

Anonymous said...

Nifong had cancer. Thats why he went to traffic court for a few years.

Anonymous said...

One big event after another--a banner day all around. Thank you NC Bar!! Maybe Freda Black, who should have won this election to begin with, will eventually take Mr. Nifong's place. The King is soon to lose his crown, I believe. It is just painful to watch someone self destruct.


Anonymous said...

NC Lawyers

Does NC have laws that take away a pension if illegal activities took place on the job or is Nifong pension safe after he swears in on Jan 2?

Anonymous said...

The impending implosion that is Nifong's career reminds me of a plane crash into a train wreck!

I only hope he does not get away with a pension, and if he does, that it is not protected from a civil judgement.

Anonymous said...

Maybe when answering the Bar complaints, he'll call them the MF word, like he has done before to other lawyer(s). I remember reading about that one in the N&O and how they reported it was loud enough to be heard throughout the sixth floor of Durham Court office building. Reaaaal professional...

There's no past indication in his persona that he is capable of admitting he made a mistake, much less exhibit contrition. My guess is that he vigorously fights the Bar complaints and is very defiant. Who would want to legally represent him? Maybe Irving Joyner?

Anonymous said...

Speaking of Freda Black, what were Nifong's reasons for firing her and were they justifiable? There must be a story there, but have not seen it.

Anonymous said...

If he hads a lawyer when he goes, it will be interesting when he gets to the "Why do they need lawyers" quote to ESPN.

Anonymous said...

8:42 - Of course, Rehab is the short term solution to his problems. Never occurred to me unilt you wrote it - Very good

Anonymous said...


Please consider doing a comparison of Nifong's (actionable) statements to those made by the Duke 88.

What is sauce for the goose (bar complaint) could be sauce for the gander (Administrative review of the 88’s comparable statements…)

It would be interesting to see the comparison..

just a thoguth.

Anonymous said...

cedarford advises every poster to ignore "theman" and then posts a lengthy response to his comments.geeez

Anonymous said...

theman is too fun to ignore. Some of the responses to him have really skewered him and that is fun to watch. Sometimes it is accomplished so easily and it really isn't sporting - almost ;).

Anonymous said...

For the Gang of 88, this case was about a lot more than just what did or did not happen on the night of the alleged crime. And it was about even more than just racial revenge.

For the Gang of 88, the case represented an opportunity to put America on trial. That was their goal. America, in their view, is THE racist, sexist, homophobic, classist society par excellance. For them, America is immoral and unjust. They are drven by a kind of hatred and loathing of America that borders on the psychotic.

These people are the true villains in all this. Mike Nifong is simply one of their more opportunistic students (figuratively, speaking).

Sadly, most people just want to talk about the consequence and not the cause of the perversion of justice.

Anonymous said...

it's called child abuse

Anonymous said...

Nifong's issues w/ Freda Black have never been made public as far as I'm aware. Nifong referred to them as a personnel issue and therefore private.

I believe beating her was his motivation in this case. Can you imagine how he would have viewed being demoted to ADA and working for Freda?? No doubt she'd have fired his azz if he didn't quit.

Anonymous said...

Bottom Line .

The Fong was prepared to surf along with the AA Durham sicophants and railroad these lads into a long time behind bars.

The Fong could not give a to** for the boys, he had no conscience at all,they were a vehicle to ride to the top .

The man was totally blinded by power and it corrupted the SOB.

The man deserves all he gets and more some!

Sorry I do not have any compassion for the man. No man is an Island; his bell tolling for him now!

I feel for his family , the boys and there families.

The nucleus for all of this was that sick prostitute who made false allegations to a fool who for his own gain used them to get us here in NC into the mess we are in now.

I just hope we see civil cases against all the perps in the Durham justice/DPD system who have aided the Fong.

Sadly the cost to NC , Durham and Duke will be very hard to talley but it must/will be millions of $$$?

Anonymous said...

You guys are wasting your time and energy going after the "88" in a legal sense. Yes, they said things they should not have said.

However, they are protected by "free speech". Furthermore, some of them are protected by laws/policies that don't extend to all people. Unlike Nifong in his job where he was supposed to be working to seek justice.

Anonymous said...

Anonymous 11:12:

I think you're missing the point.

The issue is not whether there is a legal case against the Gang of 88 (although I have wondered here if there is one) but rather the role played by multicultural liberal/socialists in creating the moral culture that made this perversion of justice possible in the first place.

If we don't address the "cause" of this case, there will be many more similar consequences (although not necessarily in the same form).

Anonymous said...

11:12 Freedom of speech does not provide protection from slander. Freedom of speech should not protect the Gang of 88 from action by Duke... some are tenured and, therefore can't be fired but there are sanctions the university can (and should, imo) impose.

Anonymous said...

Trust me. Duke has deep pockets. If they can be sued they will be. Maybe illegal search, libel etc.

E said...

I agree with the "Sword" that we need to understand what is fueling this sad mess. Nifong has played his part but this is bigger than just a doltified DA. The evil 88, Brodhead, the Durham Police, the media, the general public, etc.

Cedarford said...

cedarford advises every poster to ignore "theman" and then posts a lengthy response to his comments.geeez

Only to alert fools that he is not a real poster interested in the pros or cons of the Duke case. Only to bait and manipulate.

theman is too fun to ignore. Some of the responses to him have really skewered him and that is fun to watch. Sometimes it is accomplished so easily and it really isn't sporting - almost ;).

Except you don't skewer anyone. "Theman" is a little white twerp posing as a ebonics speaking black idiot. You don't win a thing by debunking him because he only posts on various blogs to see who is stupid enough to take him seriously and thus be suckered in as his dupe and sockpuppet.

All while he laughs at yet another dolt he has reeled in and gets ready to lay more bait for similar schnooks.

Anonymous said...

I would like to be a fly on Nifong's office wall tomorrow after tonights news.

The Fong will possibly take a sick day? I hope he thinks long and hard tomorrow, previously he had ruined Christmas for everyone by not dropping all of the charges.

Now its his time to sweat a little ?

What goes round come around Mikey.

Anonymous said...

"we need to understand what is fueling this sad mess"

Quick answer: Tolerance. We tolerate the intolerable.

Anonymous said...

Can you imagine Nifong being deposed by lawyers 10 times as bright as he is in the inevitable civil suit. Too much fun to think about.

Anonymous said...

To answer a question here:

Yes, the accused have a cause of action against the Gang of 88 if their statement(s) cast them in a way that made them an object of scorn in the community.

But there's more. In doing so, they were acting as agents of Duke University.

Duke's got serious problems here folks. Hope their insurance policy is paid in full.

As for Nifong, he's toast. NC cannot sweep this under the rug, it's national.


Anonymous said...

Nifong will get his day in court--hopefully as a defendant of some sort.

The real is this: What can be done to change the intellectual and moral culture at Duke (and at other universities)? What can the people here do to put pressure on Duke?

More to the point: What will Duke students do to restore intellectual respectability to their university? Will the "social justice" crowd at Duke bang their pots on the first day of Peter Wood's course? Will they go to William Chafe's course and get up and silently leave in protest? Will they demand that the university abolish the AAAS department and the "Marxism and Society" program?

If you are a Duke student and you believe in protesting injustice, then NOW is the time to do it. If you don't protest the actions of your administration and the Gang of 88, then, well, we'll know that you're fraudulent.

GS said...

Nifong hads no assets. You can't get his pension. His house is in the wifes name.

He will not testify or will take the 5th. Get a judgement against him and he will laugh as he cashes his pension check.

The real money comes from the city and state and maybe the Duke U.

Anonymous said...

Yes, the role of Duke here is interesting. Think about how self-destructive the school was willing to be:

1. The school has a legal relationship with the 3 students, leaving it open to potential liability, and

2. The extremely negative message the school sent to prospective parents/students by turning against 3 of their own students, in effect saying, the school will not protect you at all (consider how that might sound to a parent sending their kid away from home for the first time).

The way PC ideals led the university to such self-destructive behavior contains a potential warning to our wider society.

Anonymous said...

Don't be so sure that the falsely accused can't get Nifong's assets in a civil case.

M. Simon said...

GPrestonian said...

10:10pm Anon:

What's his preexisting condition?

10:21 PM


No moral center. Lack of ethics

M. Simon said...


theman is Nifong's sock puppet.

Anonymous said...

uh, what happens, all you gloaters, if Nifong steps down and a special prosecutor takes over and does not automatically dismiss the case? what then?

Anonymous said...

anonymous 6:12 "uh, what happens, all you gloaters, if Nifong steps down and a special prosecutor takes over and does not automatically dismiss the case? what then?"

I don't think anyone has reasons to be worried about that.

Anonymous said...

To 6:12,
In the extremely unlikely event that a new prosecutor does not dismiss, I fully expect the judge to rule in favor of the defense on its Change of Venue motion and its Lineup Motion. If the case had any merit whatsoever, we would not be online discussing it...which brings up another point. These ethical and constitutional violations exist regardless of the guilt or innocence of the accused, but their obvious innocence does make this moment very sweet indeed.


Anonymous said...

Since everyone knows, now even the NC Bar that Crystal was lying... why haven't the DPD police arrested her? She started this, she carried it through and elaborated, gave details and created this travesty...why is she not in jail? She should get the same amount in time that the 3 boys would have gotten if convicted. Crystal caused this yet she is still out their partying, pole dancing and lying. I would think the DPD would round her up right away. I would think the NC citizens would demand her arrest since her antics are going to cost the state millions of dollars. Get that menace behind bars now.

markm said...

Why hasn't Crystal been arrested? Because we all know quite well that her defense will be, "They made me do it!". They = Nifong and the police, that is. And unlike her other accusations, there's probably sufficient supporting evidence for this one.

E said...

Anon at 11:45 said:

"Quick answer: Tolerance. We tolerate the intolerable."

Yes, that is a good point. The feminist/pc/liberal ideas of tolerance are in a word, um, gerrymandered.

We all need to start putting our "foot down" and saying no! to things that should not be tolerated. Nifong, radical feminism and Misandry come to mind.

M. Simon said...

Police and prosecutorial misconduct are epidemic in America.

Nifong is only the tip of the iceberg.

Anonymous said...


I couldn't agree more.

It's been almost embarrassing to watch Cedarford come unbottoned psychologically, and in such a public forum. He's the Neville Chamberlain version of "TheMan."

I'm not a psychologist, so I won't even try to deal with his his problems. Better left ignored than engaged.

Anonymous said...

I hope that the accused players go after all the slander, lies and criminals that put them through this ordeal and that there are honest lawyers out here to help them do that in the name of "Truth, Justice, and the American Way" as Superman puts it. The number of lies and amount of deceit that this case brings loathes one to ever have to go thru the criminal justice system, how can we trust it any longer ?

scott huminski said...

The Duke defendants are very lucky that the media picked up this case. Police and prosecutorial misconduct can be far worse than what went on in Durham.


Anonymous said...

You can post your complaints about Durham-in-Wonderland on this sites to be seen by wide audience

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